What a great article. Thanks Ed. The documentary is very powerful and - I think - a very, very good thing. Even so many years later, I think it was much needed. Which makes it, to me, possibly the most morally decent thing the BBC has produced in a long time.
Thank you and yes it was very good. I put off watching it for a few weeks because I thought ‘do I have the mental strength to watch a doc about Northern Ireland’ but their previous one was so good
Growing up, it was always weird to see on the news at this time that the IRA had announced a Christmas ceasefire. A weird reminder that there was, as you say, a civil war happening on these islands.
Say Nothing by Patrick Radden Keefe is well worth a read, too.
Great essay, Ed. Watching that series, something I realized is how much I now dislike Gerry Adams. As an American descendant of Irish-Catholics, I was always sympathetic to him and his cause, but watching him drone on and on about "inclusiveness" made want to festoon my bedroom with Ian Paisley posters.
Were you perhaps more sympathetic when he was murdering innocents? Or at least, sending others to do so. Adams was a terrorist, no better than Osama Bin Laden.
Jack Kielty was murdered by Delbert Watson, son of a local loyalist farming family, a largish clan of mostly boys, not all that popular locally, even in Protestant circles, with a reputation for thuggery and fairly extreme sectarianism.
Watson’s brother Charles, a prison officer, had himself been murdered by the IRA the year before. There is a theory, that I think you’re alluding to, that Kielty was going to expose a UDA protection racket in Belfast, but, while this is possible, it seems to me more likely that simple revenge was the motive for his murder. Watson was reportedly apoplectic with rage, determined to avenge his brother and any Catholic would do. Mr Kielty was the most prominent Dundrum Catholic - a businessman and GAA official- and the one-way in/out access to his office made him a soft target (one version of the story, no consolation to Paddy Kielty) is that they had initially decided on a car dealer from nearby Clough but settled on Mr Kielty because of his office set up).
Prominence was something people tried to avoid in those dark days, as it was often enough to get you killed, Catholic or Protestant. So Mr Kielty’s murder was not particularly unusual - what is unusual is that he had a son in a position to tell his story.
A word on the GAA. While things have improved since, it was a virulently sectarian organisation during the Troubles. Mr Kielty, in his position as head of the Dundrum branch, would have very likely rubbed shoulders with people from the “other side” (to Watson) who would have been involved in the kind of thing Watson and his two accomplices inflicted on him. In saying this I’m not trying to accuse Kielty of anything or to condone his murder - just pointing out that reality close-up is often highly nuanced.
A final word on the Malone Road. Its denizens wouldn’t thank you for calling them middle class - they’re at least upper middle (NI standard). It has always been a mixed area - it’s now more Catholic, not that it’s advertised- with the residents who are a mix of business people, lawyers, doctors, academics and the like. And such respectable people never do flags.
I don’t know anything about the case tbh - is that all documented? I’m responsible for libel on this site so I can get sued if I don’t delete any allegation that hasn’t been established
Well Watson did time with his 2 accomplices - and is still vocal about his disdain for the peace agreement etc. despite the fact that he got released early because of it. And his family were - and are - quite well known locally. The theory about the other potential victim is also public knowledge.
And the GAA were very sectarian. And if you look at the people locked up on the IRA side they often had GAA connections.
I honestly don’t mind you removing the post(s) if you’re worried about libel as they might argue they were regular churchgoers and above reproach - just a reminder that things are never simple.
"what many groups do when they lose their sense of legitimacy: defeated race syndrome." I would be very interested to read more about this topic. It seems timely and relevant!
Happy the land that lives at peace. Was recently reading about terrorism in Russia in 1905-1910 and earlier. Thousands upon thousands of officials were assassinated, to widespread acclaim. It was "normal"! (discussed in Gary Saul Morson, *Wonder Confronts Certainty")
Yes, "defeated race syndrome" got my attention also. It sounds like what I, with roots in the hills of Alabama, call "lost cause-ism". Can you point to more on this?
You have a thoughtful manner of writing. Your historical essays are brief, to the point, well-balanced and always interesting. I do look at the emails from the Wrong Side of History before any other substack releases. Hope you have plans to combine your essays into an anthology called the Historical Wit and Wisdom of Ed West.
Story from my cousin. He is from Donegal, attending Trinity college in Dublin. The coaches from Donegal pass through the North. They are inspected. Three young squaddies get on Cousin has gone to Dublin to see a gig.
The Waterboys I think.
Cousin is asked by a squaddie on the bus. What is his business. He says I've been to Dublin to see the Waterboys- One of the squaddies is so interested he swings round quickly and hits someone with his gun. Then embarrassed by this he almost takes his rifle off. Trying to make amends.
"Most people in England would just rather the six counties went away."
A half-serious thought - there might be more interest in N Ireland (or Scotland or Wales) if we had a British football league - I travelled to watch my team play in Tranmere, Rotherham, Hartlepool, when I was younger. We would occasionally stay over and make a weekend of it. You talk to the locals, share a beer. If you are a southerner and have no reason to travel then these English towns can be as distant as Belfast psychologically. Although maybe if Celtic or Rangers had an away fixture it might prove a bit challenging but I always thought trips to Dunfermline, Angelsey or Larne would be great.
I visited Belfast pre-Covid and I was astonished to find out about the peace walls and the gates that had to lock at 10pm every night. To my shame I realised I had just switched off knowing about NI and probably knew more about Swedish politics than a part of my own country. The locals all seemed grimly opposed to them coming down - what does that mean for the "peace"? Is it really a peace if we still need walls to separate communities? Is it really just a cease-fire?
Yeah I’ve long thought the Scottish and Irish leagues should be absorbed into the English system but I don’t know if uefa/fifa would allow it. Rangers and Celtic in premier league and Linfield in maybe league two. Would need that tunnel built though.
Forgiveness is a wonderful thing when you can reasonably put yourself in the position of the person who blinded you or killed your dad. When you're able to say, 'Yep, in the same circumstances I can sort of imagine myself doing the same thing'. That shows real human understanding and imagination.
It's only when a man forgives the immigrant he was trying to help for raping him, or when parents forgive a gang of men for hauling their daughter out of a car and butchering her with machetes that forgiveness seems to turn from something laudable into something grotesque; a kind of moral preening; Christianity on stilts. Yet where does one cross into the other? Why can't the latter be the former, just taken slightly further? Beats me.
Fair point. I've thought about this quite a lot too. I liked Peter Hitchins' answer to this: that Christian forgiveness is only an obligation if the person who has committed the offence actually repents: if not, there is no obligation to forgive. Christ's admonition to 'turn the other cheek' forbids revenge, it doesn't mandate forgiveness for the unrepentant.
I think Hitchins is bang on the money in this regard.
I think I was viewing forgiveness less as a moral obligation, a kind of Christian duty, and more as something you want to do since you can see how the dominoes fell, one knocking down the other in predictable and understandable fashion.
Having said that you may be right in pointing to Hitchens' stress on repentance being the key. Perhaps the man who, with his mates, dragged a girl out of a car and murdered her is not quite the same person who later repents having done so and to the extent he is a different person caan perhaps be forgiven. Perhaps.
I pretty much agree with this, but I think we’re equating forgiveness with ‘letting someone off with it’ - the crime still requires atonement. Forgiveness benefits the forgiver (I’m happy to be self-absorbed in this respect). Atonement has the capacity to benefit the sinner. Though naturally not many who suffer the punishment will see it that way!
You see this is what I worry about i.e. it's all being done for the benefit of the foregiver, similar to the 'Do good because it will make you feel good' idea. Both seem to me a bit self-absorbed.
Yes, I think I agree with you. And I struggle with it personally because I tend to think that even if a form of forgiveness can be found, that doesn't mean that something is no longer owed. For example, although I admire a Christian who tried to forgive his daughter's killers - if they repented - but in the example you gave for instance, I would still think that the murderer and his accomplices should face the hangman. I am not entirely sure how to square this with my own faith, because if forgiveness is not the full remittance of the debt owed, then what is it? And yet I still believe that, repentant or not, murderers should face the death penalty.
It may be that the debt to an individual can be remitted, but not to society? I'm not sure.
Luckily, having no faith to align my feelings with, I don't have to struggle with bringing them into harmony. If I feel forgiveness then I forgive, if I don't I don't. Thinking what I SHOULD feel or do, according to Christian teachings, doesn't enter into it.
I agree that even if the father of the murdered daughter forgives the murderer, the latter should still face the death penalty, for justice and society's sake.
Where I disagree with you is in the situation where I'M the forgiver. In that situation I wouldn't want anyone I forgave to be punished, simply because my criterium for forgiveness is that I wouldn't believe he deserved to be punished. If I did, then I wouldn't forgive him!
Ed Dutton was talking a while back about how he had heard that the Pride Flag was all over the place in Belfast now and commented that both sides were "finally united under the flag of homosexuality, it's fascinating."
I haven't seen the documentary, but how do we get to the conclusion that being blinded by rubber bullets was not malicious? There were multiple cases of this, cases of direct aim, and modifications made to projectiles to make them more lethal
What a great article. Thanks Ed. The documentary is very powerful and - I think - a very, very good thing. Even so many years later, I think it was much needed. Which makes it, to me, possibly the most morally decent thing the BBC has produced in a long time.
Thank you and yes it was very good. I put off watching it for a few weeks because I thought ‘do I have the mental strength to watch a doc about Northern Ireland’ but their previous one was so good
Thanks for this.
Growing up, it was always weird to see on the news at this time that the IRA had announced a Christmas ceasefire. A weird reminder that there was, as you say, a civil war happening on these islands.
Say Nothing by Patrick Radden Keefe is well worth a read, too.
Strangely I’m reading his book on the Sacklers right now.
That's also great! I was due to see him give a talk about Say Nothing at Daunts in Marylebone in March 2020, but it got cancelled for some reason...
Say Nothing was the best read of 2019 for me. Finished it in two days.
Great essay, Ed. Watching that series, something I realized is how much I now dislike Gerry Adams. As an American descendant of Irish-Catholics, I was always sympathetic to him and his cause, but watching him drone on and on about "inclusiveness" made want to festoon my bedroom with Ian Paisley posters.
Were you perhaps more sympathetic when he was murdering innocents? Or at least, sending others to do so. Adams was a terrorist, no better than Osama Bin Laden.
Jack Kielty was murdered by Delbert Watson, son of a local loyalist farming family, a largish clan of mostly boys, not all that popular locally, even in Protestant circles, with a reputation for thuggery and fairly extreme sectarianism.
Watson’s brother Charles, a prison officer, had himself been murdered by the IRA the year before. There is a theory, that I think you’re alluding to, that Kielty was going to expose a UDA protection racket in Belfast, but, while this is possible, it seems to me more likely that simple revenge was the motive for his murder. Watson was reportedly apoplectic with rage, determined to avenge his brother and any Catholic would do. Mr Kielty was the most prominent Dundrum Catholic - a businessman and GAA official- and the one-way in/out access to his office made him a soft target (one version of the story, no consolation to Paddy Kielty) is that they had initially decided on a car dealer from nearby Clough but settled on Mr Kielty because of his office set up).
Prominence was something people tried to avoid in those dark days, as it was often enough to get you killed, Catholic or Protestant. So Mr Kielty’s murder was not particularly unusual - what is unusual is that he had a son in a position to tell his story.
A word on the GAA. While things have improved since, it was a virulently sectarian organisation during the Troubles. Mr Kielty, in his position as head of the Dundrum branch, would have very likely rubbed shoulders with people from the “other side” (to Watson) who would have been involved in the kind of thing Watson and his two accomplices inflicted on him. In saying this I’m not trying to accuse Kielty of anything or to condone his murder - just pointing out that reality close-up is often highly nuanced.
A final word on the Malone Road. Its denizens wouldn’t thank you for calling them middle class - they’re at least upper middle (NI standard). It has always been a mixed area - it’s now more Catholic, not that it’s advertised- with the residents who are a mix of business people, lawyers, doctors, academics and the like. And such respectable people never do flags.
I don’t know anything about the case tbh - is that all documented? I’m responsible for libel on this site so I can get sued if I don’t delete any allegation that hasn’t been established
Well Watson did time with his 2 accomplices - and is still vocal about his disdain for the peace agreement etc. despite the fact that he got released early because of it. And his family were - and are - quite well known locally. The theory about the other potential victim is also public knowledge.
And the GAA were very sectarian. And if you look at the people locked up on the IRA side they often had GAA connections.
I honestly don’t mind you removing the post(s) if you’re worried about libel as they might argue they were regular churchgoers and above reproach - just a reminder that things are never simple.
"what many groups do when they lose their sense of legitimacy: defeated race syndrome." I would be very interested to read more about this topic. It seems timely and relevant!
Happy the land that lives at peace. Was recently reading about terrorism in Russia in 1905-1910 and earlier. Thousands upon thousands of officials were assassinated, to widespread acclaim. It was "normal"! (discussed in Gary Saul Morson, *Wonder Confronts Certainty")
Yes, "defeated race syndrome" got my attention also. It sounds like what I, with roots in the hills of Alabama, call "lost cause-ism". Can you point to more on this?
A good column, thanks.
I think it’s a Steve Sailerism, refering both to native Americans and Anglo Americans
You have a thoughtful manner of writing. Your historical essays are brief, to the point, well-balanced and always interesting. I do look at the emails from the Wrong Side of History before any other substack releases. Hope you have plans to combine your essays into an anthology called the Historical Wit and Wisdom of Ed West.
Have a wonderful and merry Christmas!
Story from my cousin. He is from Donegal, attending Trinity college in Dublin. The coaches from Donegal pass through the North. They are inspected. Three young squaddies get on Cousin has gone to Dublin to see a gig.
The Waterboys I think.
Cousin is asked by a squaddie on the bus. What is his business. He says I've been to Dublin to see the Waterboys- One of the squaddies is so interested he swings round quickly and hits someone with his gun. Then embarrassed by this he almost takes his rifle off. Trying to make amends.
"Most people in England would just rather the six counties went away."
A half-serious thought - there might be more interest in N Ireland (or Scotland or Wales) if we had a British football league - I travelled to watch my team play in Tranmere, Rotherham, Hartlepool, when I was younger. We would occasionally stay over and make a weekend of it. You talk to the locals, share a beer. If you are a southerner and have no reason to travel then these English towns can be as distant as Belfast psychologically. Although maybe if Celtic or Rangers had an away fixture it might prove a bit challenging but I always thought trips to Dunfermline, Angelsey or Larne would be great.
I visited Belfast pre-Covid and I was astonished to find out about the peace walls and the gates that had to lock at 10pm every night. To my shame I realised I had just switched off knowing about NI and probably knew more about Swedish politics than a part of my own country. The locals all seemed grimly opposed to them coming down - what does that mean for the "peace"? Is it really a peace if we still need walls to separate communities? Is it really just a cease-fire?
Yeah I’ve long thought the Scottish and Irish leagues should be absorbed into the English system but I don’t know if uefa/fifa would allow it. Rangers and Celtic in premier league and Linfield in maybe league two. Would need that tunnel built though.
Mo Molam was trying for that. The last opportunity was when HM treasury sent Ibrox to the lower leagues.
Very good article. P.J. O'Rourke had a good piece about Northern Ireland in the 90s.
Forgiveness is a wonderful thing when you can reasonably put yourself in the position of the person who blinded you or killed your dad. When you're able to say, 'Yep, in the same circumstances I can sort of imagine myself doing the same thing'. That shows real human understanding and imagination.
It's only when a man forgives the immigrant he was trying to help for raping him, or when parents forgive a gang of men for hauling their daughter out of a car and butchering her with machetes that forgiveness seems to turn from something laudable into something grotesque; a kind of moral preening; Christianity on stilts. Yet where does one cross into the other? Why can't the latter be the former, just taken slightly further? Beats me.
Fair point. I've thought about this quite a lot too. I liked Peter Hitchins' answer to this: that Christian forgiveness is only an obligation if the person who has committed the offence actually repents: if not, there is no obligation to forgive. Christ's admonition to 'turn the other cheek' forbids revenge, it doesn't mandate forgiveness for the unrepentant.
I think Hitchins is bang on the money in this regard.
I think I was viewing forgiveness less as a moral obligation, a kind of Christian duty, and more as something you want to do since you can see how the dominoes fell, one knocking down the other in predictable and understandable fashion.
Having said that you may be right in pointing to Hitchens' stress on repentance being the key. Perhaps the man who, with his mates, dragged a girl out of a car and murdered her is not quite the same person who later repents having done so and to the extent he is a different person caan perhaps be forgiven. Perhaps.
I pretty much agree with this, but I think we’re equating forgiveness with ‘letting someone off with it’ - the crime still requires atonement. Forgiveness benefits the forgiver (I’m happy to be self-absorbed in this respect). Atonement has the capacity to benefit the sinner. Though naturally not many who suffer the punishment will see it that way!
Really not sure but I think the religious emphasis is how the offering of forgiveness benefits the soul’s growth in the forgiver?
You see this is what I worry about i.e. it's all being done for the benefit of the foregiver, similar to the 'Do good because it will make you feel good' idea. Both seem to me a bit self-absorbed.
Yes, I think I agree with you. And I struggle with it personally because I tend to think that even if a form of forgiveness can be found, that doesn't mean that something is no longer owed. For example, although I admire a Christian who tried to forgive his daughter's killers - if they repented - but in the example you gave for instance, I would still think that the murderer and his accomplices should face the hangman. I am not entirely sure how to square this with my own faith, because if forgiveness is not the full remittance of the debt owed, then what is it? And yet I still believe that, repentant or not, murderers should face the death penalty.
It may be that the debt to an individual can be remitted, but not to society? I'm not sure.
Luckily, having no faith to align my feelings with, I don't have to struggle with bringing them into harmony. If I feel forgiveness then I forgive, if I don't I don't. Thinking what I SHOULD feel or do, according to Christian teachings, doesn't enter into it.
I agree that even if the father of the murdered daughter forgives the murderer, the latter should still face the death penalty, for justice and society's sake.
Where I disagree with you is in the situation where I'M the forgiver. In that situation I wouldn't want anyone I forgave to be punished, simply because my criterium for forgiveness is that I wouldn't believe he deserved to be punished. If I did, then I wouldn't forgive him!
Happy Christmas!
Great piece, Ed.
Ed Dutton was talking a while back about how he had heard that the Pride Flag was all over the place in Belfast now and commented that both sides were "finally united under the flag of homosexuality, it's fascinating."
I haven't seen the documentary, but how do we get to the conclusion that being blinded by rubber bullets was not malicious? There were multiple cases of this, cases of direct aim, and modifications made to projectiles to make them more lethal
Maybe in some cases it was. In this case he was sort of caught in the crossfire
This is very moving. There were tears in my eyes when I finished reading it. Thank you!
Does forgiveness come more easily in some places than others?